TERRY GROSS, HOST:
This is FRESH AIR. I am Terry Gross. It's a FRESH AIR tradition that the week leading into Labor Day, we do a themed series of interviews from our archive. This week's theme is R&B, rockabilly and early rock 'n' roll. I got that idea while listening to a terrific podcast I recommend called "A History Of Rock Music In 500 Songs." While listening to the early episodes about the prehistory and early history of rock, I often found myself thinking, wait, that person is in our archive. Those are the people we'll be hearing from. Later today, we'll hear my interview with one of the pioneers of rockabilly, Carl Perkins, who wrote and made the first recording of "Blue Suede Shoes." After that, Elvis made his hit recording.
We begin our series with a guitarist on Elvis' version, Scotty Moore. He played with Elvis from 1954 to 1964. He reunited with Elvis for his 1968 comeback special. As Peter Guralnick, the author of the definitive biography of Elvis, wrote, quote, "guitar players of every generation since rock began have studied and memorized Scotty's licks, even when Scotty himself couldn't duplicate them," unquote. Scotty Moore died in 2016 at the age of 84.
We're going to hear the interview I recorded with him in 1997 after the publication of his memoir about his years with Elvis called "That's Alright, Elvis." The title is a reference to Elvis's first single, "That's All Right," which was recorded in 1954 and featured Moore on guitar. It was recorded for Sun Records, the label created and owned by Sam Phillips, who we'll hear from on tomorrow's show. When we spoke, a box set of previously unreleased Elvis tracks had just been released. We started with a previously unreleased take of "Lawdy Miss Clawdy." Listen for Scotty Moore's solo.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "LAWDY MISS CLAWDY")
UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: E2WB-1293, Take 1.
ELVIS PRESLEY: (Singing) I'm going to take, take my. Oh.
(Laugher) Yeah, something like that.
(Singing) Well, Lordy, Lordy, Lordy, Ms. Clawdy. Gal, you sure look good to me. Well, please, don't excite me, baby. No, it can't be me. Because I give you all of my money, gal, but you just won't treat me right. You like to bowl every morning, don't come home till late at night. I'm going to take, take.
GROSS: Before Scotty Moore recorded with Elvis at Sun Records, Moore recorded at Sun with his own country band, the Starlite Wranglers. That's how he got to know the owner and mastermind of Sun Records, Sam Phillips.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR CONTENT)
SCOTTY MOORE: But we became just great friends through that connection. And we'd have coffee next door at a little cafe there and just discuss the business in general. You heard so and so and the record they've got out and the way they're doing it? And different sounds. And Sam was always saying, well, if we can just find something different, we can find that little niche, you know, to get in between all this other stuff that's happening.
And Marion, his secretary, was having coffee with us one day. And she said, Sam, what about that boy who was in about a year ago and cutting that acetate for his mother? And Sam said, yeah, best I remember, he had a pretty good voice. And he turned to me, he said, give him a call and get him to come over to your house and see what you think about him. I called him. He came over on Sunday afternoon. And it seems like he knew every song in the world.
GROSS: Well, when you asked him to come over and do some songs for you, what songs did he sing?
MOORE: Everything. I mean, he did Billy Eckstine. He did Eddy Arnold. I don't remember a specific song, necessarily. But, I mean, he just knew all these songs.
GROSS: And did he do them in the style of the singer who had the hit version?
MOORE: Yes.
GROSS: So musically, you thought he was versatile. But you couldn't tell who he was.
MOORE: That's fair to say. And in fact, after he left that day, I called and relayed that basic information to Sam. I said, you remember you told us to go out and get some original material? And he said, well, he said, I'll tell you what. He said I'll call him and get him to come in for an audition, and said, just you and Bill Black come in. I don't need the whole band. I just need a little, you know, just a little noise behind him. So the next night, we went in, which was the audition. And we were taking a break when the thing exploded. Elvis just jumped up and started just flailing his guitar and singing, that's all right, mama. Just nervous energy.
GROSS: Now, that was a song by Arthur Crudup.
MOORE: Crudup, yes.
GROSS: Did you know the song when he was starting to play it?
MOORE: No, I never heard it.
GROSS: So you just started to fill in behind him not knowing the song?
MOORE: Right. Bill started just slapping the bass. And it sounded pretty good what they're doing, so I started just playing some kind of rhythm thing with them, too.
GROSS: And then Sam Phillips, the head of Sun Records, liked it and asked you to lay it down on tape?
MOORE: Yeah, he was in the control room, but the door was open when we was doing that. And he came, stuck his head out the door. He said, what are you guys doing? And we said just goofing around, you know? He said it sounded pretty good through the door, so let's put it on tape, see what it sounds like.
GROSS: Well, let's hear the version that was actually released of "That's All Right." Elvis Presley, my guest Scotty Moore on guitar.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "THAT'S ALL RIGHT")
PRESLEY: (Singing) Well, that's all right, mama. That's all right for you. That's all right, mama, just any way you do. That's all right, that's all right. That's all right now, mama, any way you do. Well, Mama, she done told me. Papa done told me, too. Son, that gal you fooling with, she ain't no good for you. But that's all right, that's all right. That's all right now, mama, any way you do. I'm leaving town, my baby.
GROSS: Now, tell me the truth. After you started recording with Elvis, did you think, this guy's a great singer? Or were you thinking, this guy's OK?
MOORE: Oh, well, we became more aware after just three records that he liked a challenge. But he was very particular about songs. He had to get into them, feel them good. Now, true, most of the stuff on Sun, it wasn't original material. There were some that were remakes of R&B and couple of country things, like "Milkcow Blues" and things like that.
But when we went to RCA, things changed. He was absolutely picking his own material then. And we'd go into the session and have a stack two feet high of acetates. And the first couple hours, he would spend going through those. And he might listen to eight bars and zap across the room. Then he'd listen about halfway, and he'd put that in another stack to come back and listen to it again.
GROSS: This is - what? - demos that had been made for him?
MOORE: Demos, right. And that's the way he did it. And very few times did I ever see him that one he'd kept in the maybe stack and would actually try, that he would then throw it away after he heard it back. He had that good a year.
GROSS: Do you remember one of the songs that was picked out of the demo pile like that?
MOORE: I think "Don't Be Cruel" was picked like that. Of course, Hill and Range could try to keep their main writers in what they thought were at the top of the stack, too, you know (laughter).
GROSS: Let me play another record from "The Sun Sessions," and I thought we'd play "Mystery Train."
MOORE: Hey, good. That's my signature song.
GROSS: Yeah. So tell me a little bit about what you're playing on this and what it was like to record this track. Share some memories about it.
MOORE: It was a slow R&B song.
GROSS: That Junior Parker had recorded before.
MOORE: That Junior Parker had. Yeah. And we ended up just getting the tempo up more, and I changed the rhythm thing around, and I've always loved it. It's just a fun thing to do.
GROSS: OK. Well, this is "Mystery Train" - Elvis Presley - my guest, Scotty Moore, on guitar.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "MYSTERY TRAIN")
PRESLEY: Train I ride, 16 coaches long. Train I ride, 16 coaches long. Well, that long, black train got my baby and gone. Train, train, coming 'round, 'round the bend. Train, train, coming 'round the bend. Well, it took my baby, but it never will again, no, not again.
GROSS: If you're just joining us, my guest is guitarist Scotty Moore, who we just heard on "Mystery Train," and he's written a new autobiography called "That's Alright, Elvis."
When did you start realizing that Elvis was really catching on in a very emotional way with his fans?
MOORE: I would say that after we did the first couple of TV shows with Tommy and Jimmy Dorsey.
GROSS: Mm-hmm.
MOORE: After we went to RCA, before that, most of our shows and stuff had been all in the Southeast. And there had been some, granted, that - starting to see the hysteria and so forth, but it really didn't come home to us till we did those shows that national exposure. Then just seemed like the floodgates opened up, you know?
GROSS: We're listening to my 1997 interview with Scotty Moore, Elvis Presley's guitarist from 1954 to '64. We'll hear more of the interview after a break. This is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF SCOTTY MOORE'S "HEARTBREAK HOTEL")
GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. Let's get back to my 1997 interview with Scotty Moore, Elvis Presley's guitarist from 1954 to '64.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR CONTENT)
GROSS: What would you say is your most copied guitar solo from the Elvis Records? Or one of the most?
MOORE: Probably "Heartbreak Hotel," maybe. I don't know. I mean, I've never been asked that before. Can we do a survey?
GROSS: (Laughter).
MOORE: Write in, folks, and tell me.
GROSS: Well, why don't we go for "Heartbreak Hotel?"
MOORE: OK.
GROSS: Tell me your memories of this session.
MOORE: Well, of course, that was the first one on RCA. They were trying to get basically the same sound that Sam was getting - had gotten with us in Memphis. They had this big, long hallway out in the front that had the tile floor. So they put a big speaker at one end of it, and mic at the other end, and the sign, do not enter. And they used that. That's where it ended up with that deep, real room echo instead of the tape delay echo that Sam had used. Now, there is - it's hard to hear. There is a little tape delay on it, but either - their tape machine didn't match his. And so it's just very slight, and then he ended up just with the acoustic echo.
I'll give them credit. They didn't - I don't think they knew. Maybe they didn't think about it, but a room echo, at that point, was sound effects they used in the movies. They weren't using them for recording. And then here comes this, and it's so drastic. But it worked for the song. When you say, you know, at the end of Lonely Street, and it's so distant. And I like to say this, if you don't mind, and speaking of these technical things, one thing that Sam did that I don't believe he realized when he was doing it, and I didn't until years later that I got into engineering, he pulled Elvis' voice back close to the music. You know, all the Sinatra and all those things where the voice is so far out in front. And he more or less used Elvis' voice as another instrument.
GROSS: Into the mix.
MOORE: Into the mix. But didn't bury him, like a lot of the rock things, you know, later.
GROSS: Right. Now, your solo on "Heartbreak Hotel," is that something you had prepared before the session, or is it something you had worked out?
MOORE: No, no.
GROSS: No?
MOORE: No, everything we ever did was just spur of the moment.
GROSS: Did you learn the song at the session, or did you know it before that?
MOORE: No, learned it at the session.
GROSS: Well, alright. Let's hear it. 1956, "Heartbreak Hotel."
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "HEARTBREAK HOTEL")
PRESLEY: (Singing) Well, since my baby left me, well, I found a new place to dwell. Well, it's down at the end of Lonely Street at Heartbreak Hotel where I'll be, I'll be just so lonely, baby, well, I'm so lonely. I'll be so lonely, I could die. Although it's always crowded, you still can find some room for broken-hearted lovers to cry there in their gloom. Be so, they'll be so lonely, baby. They get so lonely. They're so lonely, they could die.
(Singing) Now, the bellhop's tears keep flowing, and the desk clerk's dressed in black. Well, they've been so long on Lonely Street, well, they'll never, they'll never look back. And they get so, they get so lonely, baby. Well, they are so lonely. They're so lonely, they could die. Well, now, if your baby leaves you, and you've got a tale to tell, well, just take a walk down Lonely Street to Heartbreak Hotel. Where you will be, you will be so lonely, baby. Well, you will be lonely. You'll be so lonely, you could die.
GROSS: That's "Heartbreak Hotel." My guest, Scotty Moore, on guitar, and he's written an autobiography, which, of course, includes his years playing guitar with Elvis Presley. It's called "That's Alright, Elvis."
When did you stop playing with Elvis, and what was behind stopping?
MOORE: The - well, actually, the 1968 special, what you now they call the comeback special.
GROSS: The TV special where he's wearing the leather jacket...
MOORE: Yeah.
GROSS: ...And the leather pants.
MOORE: Right. He was - I mean, he would - it might sound funny for a man to say, but he was an absolute Adonis on that show.
GROSS: Mm-hmm.
MOORE: He looked good. He was in great shape. And if that man had a pill in him at that point, well, I'd like for them to prove it to me. I mean, he was just - and he was ready. He was nervous because he - when he found out he was going to have to - these two little groups he brought in, when we did our in the round thing, that made him nervous. But he was anxious. He only had, I think, one more movie to finish before all the contracts were done, and he wanted to get back performing. That's where he was best at, what he loved to do.
GROSS: When you stopped playing with Elvis, you virtually gave up the guitar for, I don't know, close to 25 years.
MOORE: Twenty-four years, right.
GROSS: And I guess I can't understand that.
MOORE: Well, after I sold my studio, then I started a tape duplicating company.
GROSS: Mm-hmm.
MOORE: And then also an industrial printing company. And so I was pretty busy. I mean, there really wasn't time for thinking about playing. I sold what guitars I had.
GROSS: You started playing again, what, in the early '90s, was it?
MOORE: '92.
GROSS: Mm-hmm. And what was behind that?
MOORE: Well, I'll have to back up a little bit there. About 18 - two years. '90, I went to a little gathering with - for Carl Perkins. Carl and I, of course, had known each other from "Sundays." I had done one session with Carl in '75. He wrote a song with all Elvis song titles called "E.P. Express." But other than that, we never had recorded anything together. And that's when this guy asked, says, why don't you guys record something? And Carl and I looked at each other and said, well, why not?
GROSS: When you picked up your guitar about 24 years after you'd put it down to record with Carl Perkins, had you played it - I mean, did you remember how to play? Had you played at home in...
MOORE: No.
GROSS: ...The interim?
MOORE: No, I didn't even have any guitars.
GROSS: Gosh. And can you tell me you didn't miss it those years?
MOORE: I really didn't. I thought about that really hard. And it - well, I was so busy doing other things, I guess. It just - and - but the thing that really got me when I realized it was in my blood, the Elvis celebration, August of that year, '92, I went to Memphis and did the show with Carl. And I'm standing over in the wings, Carl's fixing to bring me out. And I'm thinking to myself, you're supposed to be nervous. And I walked out and it just bothered me a bit. And I was really surprised. And that's when I told myself, it's you your blood. You might as well admit it.
(LAUGHTER)
GROSS: Well, Scotty Moore, I'm really glad you're playing again. And a pleasure to have the chance to talk with you.
MOORE: Terry, it's been a pleasure and enjoyable.
GROSS: My interview with Scotty Moore was recorded in 1997. He died in 2016 at age 84. After we take a short break, we'll hear from Carl Perkins, the Rockabilly guitarist and singer who wrote and first recorded "Blue Suede Shoes" and a song The Beatles later recorded, "Honey Don't." Let's listen to the song Moore and Perkins recorded together in 1975. This is "E.P. Express." I'm Terry Gross, and this is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "E.P. EXPRESS")
CARL PERKINS: (Singing) Well, I put my hound dog on your trail. I found you down at Heartbreak Hotel. But that's alright now, Mama, any way you do. Saw Polk Salad Annie, she was shaking her fanny. You're right, I'm left, she's gone. But I'm warning you, man, lay off my blue suede shoes. Woah, ho, baby, baby, let's play house and forget it. And don't be cruel to your guitar man. Honey, love me tender forever. But I'm going to take you to that promised land. Well, I'm all shook up, and I can't stop. Going to do a little bit of the jailhouse rock. The mystery train done jumped the tracks again So, honey, let's go our separate ways. Blue Hawaii, I'm here to stay. There's a whole lot of shaking going on again. Alright now.
(SOUNDBITE OF CYRUS CHESTNUT'S "HOUND DOG")
GROSS: This is FRESH AIR. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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